Obasanjo is part of Nigeria’s problem–Bishop Chukwuma

Emmanuel Chukwuma, the Anglican Archbishop of Enugu Ecclesiasti­cal Province is reputed for speaking his mind on national issues without mind­ing whose ox is gored. In this interview, he commented on diverse national issues in­cluding President Jonathan and General Bu­hari’s presidential candidacies, former Presi­dent Obasanjo’s controversial book and the alleged contempt of court issue which resulted from the book launch, as well as the politics of 2015 in Enugu State.

According to him, the Anglican Church will resist any attempt to deny the church the op­portunity of producing the deputy governor of Enugu State. And on the fate of the Chairman of the Senate Committee on Works, Chief Ayogu Eze, and the parallel PDP governorship candidate of the state, the cleric said the best bet for the lawmaker is to sheath his sword and support Hon Ifeanyi Ugwuanyi who is the pre­ferred candidate of Enugu people.

Excerpts

What is your take on the recent controversial book launched by for­mer President Obasanjo, which has led to a face-off between him and some individuals?

As far as I’m concerned, I do not think that it was right for the court or anybody to bar the former President from launching his book because such action could be seen to imply that some people want to cover the truth. Why were they asking him not to launch the book? Were they attempting to cover up something or what? If you are sincere, that what the man wrote in his book is not true, let the whole world look at it and see for them­selves. So, preventing him from launching a book he has suffered to put together is like at­tempting to cover up one’s sins and it is not acceptable at all. And if somebody realises that what he has done is not good, he should quickly repent and make amends. But the truth is that the man at the centre of the whole issue – Obasanjo – is also part of the problem we have today. Whatever problem we have today, he is part of the cause. He is reaping the consequences of his selfishness which has now backfired on him.

What do you make of the present security situation as the kidnapped Chibok girls are yet to be left off the hook and Boko Haram insurgents are still striking even as 2015 general elections are almost here?

One thing we must realise is that terrorism is not only prevalent in Nigeria but across the entire world, as we speak. It is even more severe in so many other countries. But with prayers and sincere cooperation of all Nigeri­ans, we will definitely win the war against ter­rorism, to the glory of God. But more impor­tantly, our security chiefs must be sincere and absolutely patriotic for the war against Boko Haram to be effective. They must ensure that all the monies released by the government for the purpose of fighting insurgency are utilised sincerely for the same purpose. I am certain that if the military puts in their best sincerely in the fight, backed up with sincere prayers, the insurgents will be overrun in no time. So, all these happenings in the country still boil down to seeking the face of God for divine intervention and cleansing of the land.

Some people have argued that the President is not sincere in his war against terrorism in Nigeria. What is your view?

I think he is sincerely committed to it and would do anything within his powers and re­sources to win the war. But those he has put at the helm of affairs must be sincerely com­mitted and absolutely patriotic for the effort of the President to work. Otherwise, all that effort will just end up in futility. The issue of terrorism is a matter of stakeholders putting their hands on deck and everybody cooperat­ing and not just a matter of leaving everything to security agents alone.

President Jonathan has formally emerged the candidate of the PDP in his re-election bid and TAN has been wooing the people South east to support the president again even as he failed to fulfil most promises to the zone in 2011. How do you see his chances this time?

Well, it depends on what people want. For me, the thing that may help him to get block votes in the South-east is because he is a Christian and not because he has impressed the people as they expected. But looking at the whole situation, corruption is still in very high percentage and people would have pre­ferred General Buhari if he was not a Mus­lim. That is just the truth. They would have preferred him to be the next President so he can bring sanity back into the system as far as

corruption is concerned. There is a belief that he still has what it takes to fight corruption like he did as military leader. So, Jonathan has to look at that area. There should be serious dis­cipline in the Nigerian government because virtually all past administrations have brought more poverty than wealth to the country. You find that people are not empowered as such. There is so much nepotisim in the system such that empowerment is not spread on merit. If you do not know anybody, you are on your own and that is a terrible situation.

You have been crying out over the terrible state of federal roads in the South-east and I believe you are pleased that they are now being at­tended to?

Where did you get such information from? Enugu-Onitsha road is a death-trap and Enu­gu-Port Harcourt road is a disgrace. So many roads are in terrible condition and we are not happy about it. Even the second Niger Bridge is becoming a sort of political gimmick. Is it the Onitsha Harbour? I have cried out before and I say it again that it is a farce. No ship has ever berthed there since the so-called dredging was carried out. The dredging has not been done at all. So, most of those projects are deceitful and whitewashed projects. I once wrote an article titled: Igbos in Jonathan’s government and it was published in three major national newspa­pers. And I stated there that Jonathan has not done much for Ndigbo as far as I’m concerned. I still stand by that.

As you blame Mr President for the collapsed state of roads in the South­east, remember that he has aides and cannot be everywhere; and incidental­ly, both committee chairmen on works in both chambers of the National As­sembly are from the South-east. Why not blame them for not being smart enough?

Those ones? Even the Chairman of FERMA is from Enugu State. They are all a disgrace to the South-east. You can see how almost all of them failed during the last party primary elec­tions. Politicians should realise that people are becoming wiser now. It is a pity that whenever we complained to Mr President, he would say, ‘it’s your people’.

That makes things easier for you since you once vowed to use your of­fice as the chairman of CAN in South- east to ensure that re-election bid of selfish politicians and sidon-de-look lawmakers are stopped in the area?

Yes, I did say that we will stop re-election bid of bench-warmer lawmakers especially at the National Assembly because they were not voted into office just to become ‘yes’ members. We should stop deceiving ourselves. We have many credible people who have all it takes to represent the South-east at any forum. So, it is a huge disgrace for us to have any incompe­tent person as our representative at the National Assembly. We need experienced and credible individuals this time to represent us at all levels of government and not mediocres. There are young people of 40, 50 and a little over 50 that are very experienced, sharp and super hot, with good pedigree and who can do the job across the nation, not individuals that are already ex­pired and who always fight with their blood to perpetuate themselves in various political offic­es. We must stop putting new wine in old wine skin because it will burst. Last time I pointed this out, I incurred the wrath of politicians. That was when I advised during the heat of PDP cri­sis that former PDP Chairman, Alhaji Baman­ga Tukur, Chief Tony Anenih and over 60 other politicians are expired and should withdraw from active politics and party leadership. But people didn’t listen to me until the situation got out of hand before they removed Tukur and brought in Adamu Muazu. I say it again that digital and analogue cannot work together because they are like two strange birds. So, all political analogue brains should step aside for younger breeds with digital brains to step in for the good of our nation.

You said that Gen Buhari would have been a better presidential material in 2015 had it been he was Christian. Do you have personal issues with his per­son, his candidacy or his religion?

General Buhari is a fanatical Muslim. That is just what I have against him. Forget that he is taming his utterances now because of his re­newed presidential bid. Personally, I don’t ac­cept his ways. Some of his past statements and pronouncements were inciting and warlike and not befitting of a statesman and former Head of State. This is a leader who once pronounced that blood would flow and that he would make the country ungovernable if he loses the Presi­dential election. And we were all witnesses to what happened after he lost that election. Such stance is unacceptable because he does not own Nigeria. It is unfortunate that he made such statement publicly because it will defi­nitely work against him in the coming election. It was after that statement that Boko Haram ensued and that was the basis for which he was linked to the activities of the sect. So, people should realise that it is God who makes kings and people should be careful not to make incit­ing statements carelessly because anything can happen afterwards. That is what I have against him. He should have humbled himself because he is over 70 with a bank of experience, but he has to be very careful how he makes state­ments. If God says he will be President and people vote him in, so be it, and then he should try and balance his religious sentiments.

Do you think that Jonathan will get block votes from the South-east con­sidering the number of his unfulfilled promises to the zone as you pointed out earlier?

I think they will vote for him on grounds of tribal sentiments. The situation will be, ‘we cannot but vote for our brother, our son and our own’. But as far as I am concerned, he should prove himself in terms of discipline and good governance. There should be absolute sincerity of purpose, transparent and convincing fight against corruption in the system.

There are pockets of kicks in Enugu State, against the last PDP primary election that produced Hon Ifeanyi Ug­wuanyi, even after the peace meeting that made the state governor to cede his senatorial ambition to the Deputy Senate President, Ike Ekweremadu. What is your take on that?

What you have to realise is that the political tension that was experienced in the state was as a result of the governor’s senatorial ambi­tion and incidentally, the seat he was eyeing happened to be the one being occupied by Senator Ike Ekweremadu, who is one of the few performing senators from the South-east. And he is interested in being re-elected. Remember that at a time, Ekweremadu was reported to be interested in becoming the gov­ernor of the state but the slot was later zoned to Nsukka zone. Then he showed interest in returning to the Senate and you want to deny him that again? Such move would naturally cause problem because the major players are political gladiators. In organised climes, expe­rienced and credible lawmakers are allowed to return for as many times as possible. For me, Ekweremadu has done well as a Senator. He is the best performing Senator in this area. And I felt very disappointed as an Anglican Bishop because he is the only Anglican Sena­tor I have in the Senate and they wanted to deny me of that singular slot. I was ready to battle it out because we must learn to balance political slots and appointments so as not to create unnecessary suspicions and problems. We don’t accept a situation where you slant such positions to favour a section of the faith. So, it was good that the governor allowed Ekweremadu.

But all I am saying now is that the next governor must pick an Anglican as his deputy, otherwise we will not accept it because as we speak, we have been marginalised and we are not the minority in Enugu State. Anglicans must be given their rightful position in this state. I have eight other bishops in this state and we have all it takes to fight for our right if there is any attempt to deny us that. If you look at all the structures that we have in gov­ernment now, I don’t have an Anglican as the governor or deputy; none as Speaker, Chief of Staff or Secretary to the State Government. No Anglican is among all the major heads in the state. That is not acceptable. And we are ready to fight it out this time because we An­glicans must be prominent in the incoming government.

But should Enugu State politics be based on religious sentiment or cred­ibility and pedigree?

This is not an issue of religious sentiment. It is something that calls for sound understand­ing. Muslim-Muslim ticket can never work in Nigeria and Christian-Christian ticket cannot work too. Anyone that thinks it will work is deceiving himself. And it is the same way in Enugu State. Since we are a Christian state with various denominations, efforts should be made to accommodate all denominations to avoid problems. It is natural. It is just like in the homestead, if any individual is not carried along, he will feel sidelined and that will cre­ate problems. So, it is totally unacceptable for any government to be Roman Catholic-ori­ented in Enugu State. We have to share slots together. The way Muslim-Muslim ticket or Christian-Christian ticket is not acceptable in Nigeria; Catholic-Catholic ticket is also unac­ceptable in Enugu State. And that is how it should be in all states.

What becomes of Senator Ayogu Eze who is fighting tooth and nail to secure the governorship slot?

My advice to him is that he cannot have a parallel primary election against the main one. That cannot work. So, he should go and look for another job to do. We are not even happy with him because he failed the South­east as the chairman of Senate Committee on Works. He did not perform and I have chal­lenged him many times on that without any positive result. So, he should know that he is not popular among his people. And his pres­ent action is only confirming what I had said in the past that Nsukka people are not organ­ised and I advised them to put their house in order if they want the ceding of governorship slot to their zone to work. But they started fighting me. The State Chairman of PDP, Vita Abba was the first to attack me because he had governorship ambition. Now he has also been rubbished. Why is Ayogu fighting on in­stead of supporting the person that majority of the people has nominated? He should know that governorship is nobody’s birthright, he should return home to settle with his people. I always advise politicians to invest wisely while in power so that they will have some­thing to fall back on at the end of the day and not using the money to force themselves back into power.

Is it true that you played a key role in prevailing on the governor to step down for Ekweremadu?

I only played a role in prevailing on Ekwer­emadu to calm down because if he had said ‘no way,’ then the situation would have heated up more dangerously.

Some church leaders are not com­fortable about CAN President’s very close relationship with the Aso Rock, what about you?

I am against the President of CAN being too close to the President and I have criticised it vehemently. CAN does not involve in ac­tive politics. We only operate as watchdogs and that is what it should be. When you begin to wine and dine with the powers that be, you become so polluted that you cannot speak the truth to them. For me, I have said it before, I will never dine or mess myself up with any political leadership whereby I will not be able to speak and condemn their act of bad gover­nance where necessary. It is our duty to pray for them but we must also be ready to always speak with boldness against all evil acts of government.